Nari nodded slowly, her face intent as if she were trying to carve Cyril's words into her memory. The watchword part though; she bit at her lip and remembered. The scars on his back had looked ...angry. Not necessarily ill-taken care of, but as if every single one of them had been meant. They didn't seem the handiwork of a man who would ask her to stop. Who would want her to.
"What if they don't want to use one?" she asked slowly, "What if what they want is--I can't make--this is for them. I want to do right by them, even if that means--" Means what? Beating him barely conscious? Where was the line? She sighs heavily, apparently unable to form the thought coherently. Safety. Safety was the line. Mythal her witness she was not adding her own permanent threads to the brutal tapestry he'd spread across himself. "How do I know if it's not safe anymore? When to say no, even if that's not what they want?"
Cyril pressed his lips together and looked away from Nari for a moment, clearly thinking this over. Then, after taking a breath and coming to a decision, he focused back on her.
"Nahariel, I'm going to say something, and I don't want you to see it as a judgement. You are a grown woman and you can make your own choices," he started there because he didn't want her to think he was trying to tell her what to do. That was ultimately her choice.
"But... I wouldn't be with this person. As I said before, a major part of doing this is trust and communication. If you have good reason to believe that the person you are talking about can't share when they are reaching their limit, they aren't a good person to do this with. You need to be able to trust that your partner will talk to you when it's too much. If you can't, you might need to step away..." He needed to say that because what she had just told him raised some major red flags in his mind. He isn't sure that he could ever trust a partner like what she described.
"That said, if you are certain you still want to do this, I can tell you some signs to look for when it comes to physical damage and how a person responds when they are in this state... but you need to make sure that your emotional state is tended to as well. Part of that is being able to trust that your partner won't push you beyond what you are comfortable with. You, as the one giving the pain, are in just as much risk as the person receiving it."
Her first instinct was immediately defensive, but she marshaled it harshly. This was too important for half-nocked responses, and going in to such an arrangement blind to what it meant wouldn’t help either of them, so instead she dragged her fingers through her hair, breathed deeply and released it slowly in a quiet whistle through her teeth, looked up at the flickering light on the ceiling, and thought--really thought--about what Cyril had said.
Setting aside her deep guilt that he’d taken an arrow because of her—one of Sedi’s arrows—because that was no road to begin, walking away from what she’d seen would mean walking away from some deep wound, some truth that wasn’t hers to have. And walking away wouldn’t make him stop. It was very possible he wouldn't tell her when to stop because he didn't know what his limit was. As far as she could tell, Cade Harrimann didn't have limits his own body didn't enforce. Whether that was from some bright zeal that drove him ragged before it or from some reckless love affair with his own destruction didn't matter. Inside him there was something small, and tired, and scared, and so very very alone that it lanced through her heart, and that thing needed to learn it could be safe. Looked after. Protected until it could stand alone. If it was hubristic folly to think she could give that, then let it be folly. There was risk, yes, but it was a risk she could choose. A choice he didn't have anymore. It would hurt her more to turn away than to fail.
And so, staring at a ceiling built by men, she found herself making nearly the same fierce vow she had made almost two decades before, looking down at the precious child whose eyes had never seen fire; this time for a man whose eyes had never seen its lack.
This world will not touch you like that. Not again. Not while I stand.
She looked back at Cyril. "Tell me what to watch for."
He accepts that, because he had promised her that he wasn't judging her. He was willing to trust her and believe that she was ready to do this. She had come for help, not for him butting into her personal life. If she was going to do this, then he needed make sure that she could do so safely.
"Physically, you need to watch where you hit them. There are areas of the body that can take more abuse than others. The... fleshier bits? The arse, shoulders, arms, legs. Those are generally safe. You want to avoid anything around this area." He gestures towards around his kidneys in his front and back. "And if possible, try not to cross the wounds. It's easier if you can strike in slightly different places each time, rather than digging into the same wounds over and over. With whipping you want to avoid the face and neck whenever possible. You'll want to figure out how comfortable you are with blood, Nari. Because depending on the type of whip and how hard you strike them, the welts will open. You need to know if that's a stopping point for you."
He thinks, to figure out if he's missing anything. "I would practice beforehand too, so you understand the aim of the thing and how it feels in your arm. You can probably stuff a pillow or something and set it on the bed or whatever other surface you plan to use so you can have it be the same height. That way you'll know how best to move your arm, and how the whip moves. If you want, bring the whip to me before hand so I can look over the quality and type, make sure it will work for this."
He considers her for a moment, and bites his lip. "Are they going to be tied down when you do this? Because then we should talk about type of rope, and signs that it might be too tight or digging into them too much...?"
Some of Nari's seriousness shifts to relief when Cyril doesn't try to warn her off again (she needs to bring him something nicer than wood) and then back to a hint of her initial trepidation at his mention of types of whips and practice.
"Which type do you think might be best for a beginning? And where does one even obtain a whip for this purpose?" Probably Orlais. Or she could make one herself, given time to study one already made--although that would mean already having one.
"And... no, not tied. At least not now." she cuts herself off with a small self-conscious smile. "Cyril, please tell me if this is a bother. I don't... I didn't know anyone else to go to."
"Something of good quality should work. We might need to see about importing it. Unless your person has one they like," he answers her question first, but then focus on her concern.
"You aren't a bother, Nari. Honestly, I'm flattered that you would think to come to me and that you were comfortable enough to ask this. It means something that you want to go into this with both eyes open." He offers her a reassuring smile.
"Trust me, nothing could be more mortifying than how I found out about this stuff. I had the Crafter of Ashara Clan sit me down and give me a several days worth of education." He chuckles a bit. "Did you get a chance to meet her? Nomaya, very intimidating woman."
When he names Nomaya Nari nods, a grin breaking across her face, "I did. She's an accomplished woman. The lines of her work are so clean, but they move. Did she start you on your interest in the puzzle--" she bites her lip and then chuckles, pulling up her feet so her perch is cross legged, "Abelas, if we get started talking about art..." Well, she'd never stop. "But from her, truly? That must have been something. What spurred that particular set of lessons, if you don't mind my asking?" The idea that even Cyril had been a novice once was a comforting one.
He doesn't mind talking about it. He hopes it might help her feel more comfortable. Though it does show how stupid he had been.
"When I was sixteen I finally couldn't handle my desires anymore. I went out and found some humans. I think they were a mercenary group. I'm lucky they didn't kill me, honestly. But I let them do whatever they liked to me. It was... rather intense." He rubs the back of his neck in sheepishness as he admits that he did such a foolish thing.
"I came limping back to camp and she took one look at me and dragged me to her aravel. She claimed she was taking me to work on a project, but mostly she made sure I healed and spent a few days instructing me on how to properly do this stuff. Though her lessons included quite a lot about sex in general. I was a virgin before that... I really went about the whole thing in the most stupid way possible."
"But a good lesson on why it's important not to shove it all in a corner and let those feelings build like that if you can help it," Nari muses when he's finished with his story, trying not to think too much about what could very well have happened to him. "It wasn't stupid, Cyril. You wouldn't call a woman on the edge of starving eating whatever mushroom she could scrape from the ground stupid if she poisoned herself, would you? Reckless, maybe. Incautious. But not stupid." She pauses, nodding seriously. "I'm glad you were okay," she says, "I'm glad you have people now."
"And I'm glad you do too, to enable you to be safer and better educated when you go into it," Cyril replies with a warm smile. "Do you feel more confident now? We could still talk about how to tend to your person afterwards."
Nari snorts gently, raises her eyesbrows, and ruffles her hair again simultaneously, a faint disbelieving smile on her lips, "I can't say I am confident, but I could say more, yes. I'd like to be ready, but I've the feeling that there is no being ready. Not the first time. Not really." The thought is heavy on her, obviously. "I know there's no way to be good without practice, that that's the way of every craft, but I feel like I'm a green novice being handed an aged piece of ironbark heartwood and the arulin'holm when I've never even touched pine... and not only that, but that heartwood is trusting me to find its shape. I have to be--I can't--" Nari blows out a breath, her fingers picking at each other nervously, "--I can't be this nervous," she says, changing direction mid-thought, her vulnerability turning into wry observation. "I know I can't. I'd never manage the first swing. I just want... to do right by them." She lets that sit in the air a moment, and then nods and straightens her shoulders back up.
"Which does mean we should talk about afterwards then, yes."
He understands where she's coming from and after a moment he comes closer and touches her arm lightly. He wants to provide some kind of physical comfort to her, to let her know that she is stronger than she thinks.
"It's... different for everyone. But there's going to need to be some kind of care for both of you. You'll need it just as much as your partner. For me, I need my wounds tended and some kind of physical affection. Providing that affection usually helps my partner feel connected too.
Your person might need something else, though. That's another thing you should talk about in detail before. You'll need to have what you need nearby. I'd suggest having water on hand, clean bandages, possibly some potions or healing salve as well. If they know how they respond after a session, see if they can tell you. Some cry, or curl up, or shake. There's a lot going on in your mind and heart in that state and there's such an intense sense of release afterwards. Your emotions can get jumbled. You both will need to be prepared."
Despite not being much for casual physical connection, Cyril's touch on her arm is grounding rather than uncomfortable. Enough so that Nari reaches up to give his slim hand a brief squeeze of thanks. Listening to him explain what was necessary, what might be needed, it all seemed so intimate. Was so intimate. But despite that, she feels warm and clear--a feeling she vastly prefers to the feverish riot of uncertainty that made her face burn and her heart stutter. Perhaps it was that the things she felt had somewhere to go now. Perhaps it was the centering that having someone to care for had always given her. Either way, it was a gift.
"I will, as much as I can be," Nari says with a nod. "You've given me a lot to think about, and I'm grateful. Very much so."
She stretches a bit, unfolding her legs and lengthening them before setting her feet on the ground with a satisfied sigh; much lighter than any of her previous exhalations had been. "So, in the interest of preparation... who is it I'm meant to go place an order with?"
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no subject
Date: 2018-02-20 04:58 am (UTC)"What if they don't want to use one?" she asked slowly, "What if what they want is--I can't make--this is for them. I want to do right by them, even if that means--" Means what? Beating him barely conscious? Where was the line? She sighs heavily, apparently unable to form the thought coherently. Safety. Safety was the line. Mythal her witness she was not adding her own permanent threads to the brutal tapestry he'd spread across himself. "How do I know if it's not safe anymore? When to say no, even if that's not what they want?"
no subject
Date: 2018-02-21 02:24 am (UTC)"Nahariel, I'm going to say something, and I don't want you to see it as a judgement. You are a grown woman and you can make your own choices," he started there because he didn't want her to think he was trying to tell her what to do. That was ultimately her choice.
"But... I wouldn't be with this person. As I said before, a major part of doing this is trust and communication. If you have good reason to believe that the person you are talking about can't share when they are reaching their limit, they aren't a good person to do this with. You need to be able to trust that your partner will talk to you when it's too much. If you can't, you might need to step away..." He needed to say that because what she had just told him raised some major red flags in his mind. He isn't sure that he could ever trust a partner like what she described.
"That said, if you are certain you still want to do this, I can tell you some signs to look for when it comes to physical damage and how a person responds when they are in this state... but you need to make sure that your emotional state is tended to as well. Part of that is being able to trust that your partner won't push you beyond what you are comfortable with. You, as the one giving the pain, are in just as much risk as the person receiving it."
no subject
Date: 2018-02-21 05:19 am (UTC)Setting aside her deep guilt that he’d taken an arrow because of her—one of Sedi’s arrows—because that was no road to begin, walking away from what she’d seen would mean walking away from some deep wound, some truth that wasn’t hers to have. And walking away wouldn’t make him stop. It was very possible he wouldn't tell her when to stop because he didn't know what his limit was. As far as she could tell, Cade Harrimann didn't have limits his own body didn't enforce. Whether that was from some bright zeal that drove him ragged before it or from some reckless love affair with his own destruction didn't matter. Inside him there was something small, and tired, and scared, and so very very alone that it lanced through her heart, and that thing needed to learn it could be safe. Looked after. Protected until it could stand alone. If it was hubristic folly to think she could give that, then let it be folly. There was risk, yes, but it was a risk she could choose. A choice he didn't have anymore. It would hurt her more to turn away than to fail.
And so, staring at a ceiling built by men, she found herself making nearly the same fierce vow she had made almost two decades before, looking down at the precious child whose eyes had never seen fire; this time for a man whose eyes had never seen its lack.
This world will not touch you like that. Not again. Not while I stand.
She looked back at Cyril. "Tell me what to watch for."
no subject
Date: 2018-02-21 05:37 am (UTC)"Physically, you need to watch where you hit them. There are areas of the body that can take more abuse than others. The... fleshier bits? The arse, shoulders, arms, legs. Those are generally safe. You want to avoid anything around this area." He gestures towards around his kidneys in his front and back. "And if possible, try not to cross the wounds. It's easier if you can strike in slightly different places each time, rather than digging into the same wounds over and over. With whipping you want to avoid the face and neck whenever possible. You'll want to figure out how comfortable you are with blood, Nari. Because depending on the type of whip and how hard you strike them, the welts will open. You need to know if that's a stopping point for you."
He thinks, to figure out if he's missing anything. "I would practice beforehand too, so you understand the aim of the thing and how it feels in your arm. You can probably stuff a pillow or something and set it on the bed or whatever other surface you plan to use so you can have it be the same height. That way you'll know how best to move your arm, and how the whip moves. If you want, bring the whip to me before hand so I can look over the quality and type, make sure it will work for this."
He considers her for a moment, and bites his lip. "Are they going to be tied down when you do this? Because then we should talk about type of rope, and signs that it might be too tight or digging into them too much...?"
no subject
Date: 2018-02-21 07:12 am (UTC)"Which type do you think might be best for a beginning? And where does one even obtain a whip for this purpose?" Probably Orlais. Or she could make one herself, given time to study one already made--although that would mean already having one.
"And... no, not tied. At least not now." she cuts herself off with a small self-conscious smile. "Cyril, please tell me if this is a bother. I don't... I didn't know anyone else to go to."
no subject
Date: 2018-02-22 02:07 am (UTC)"You aren't a bother, Nari. Honestly, I'm flattered that you would think to come to me and that you were comfortable enough to ask this. It means something that you want to go into this with both eyes open." He offers her a reassuring smile.
"Trust me, nothing could be more mortifying than how I found out about this stuff. I had the Crafter of Ashara Clan sit me down and give me a several days worth of education." He chuckles a bit. "Did you get a chance to meet her? Nomaya, very intimidating woman."
no subject
Date: 2018-02-22 02:58 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2018-02-22 03:09 am (UTC)"When I was sixteen I finally couldn't handle my desires anymore. I went out and found some humans. I think they were a mercenary group. I'm lucky they didn't kill me, honestly. But I let them do whatever they liked to me. It was... rather intense." He rubs the back of his neck in sheepishness as he admits that he did such a foolish thing.
"I came limping back to camp and she took one look at me and dragged me to her aravel. She claimed she was taking me to work on a project, but mostly she made sure I healed and spent a few days instructing me on how to properly do this stuff. Though her lessons included quite a lot about sex in general. I was a virgin before that... I really went about the whole thing in the most stupid way possible."
no subject
Date: 2018-02-22 03:20 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2018-02-23 02:48 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2018-02-23 04:32 am (UTC)"Which does mean we should talk about afterwards then, yes."
no subject
Date: 2018-02-23 05:03 am (UTC)"It's... different for everyone. But there's going to need to be some kind of care for both of you. You'll need it just as much as your partner. For me, I need my wounds tended and some kind of physical affection. Providing that affection usually helps my partner feel connected too.
Your person might need something else, though. That's another thing you should talk about in detail before. You'll need to have what you need nearby. I'd suggest having water on hand, clean bandages, possibly some potions or healing salve as well. If they know how they respond after a session, see if they can tell you. Some cry, or curl up, or shake. There's a lot going on in your mind and heart in that state and there's such an intense sense of release afterwards. Your emotions can get jumbled. You both will need to be prepared."
no subject
Date: 2018-02-23 06:37 am (UTC)"I will, as much as I can be," Nari says with a nod. "You've given me a lot to think about, and I'm grateful. Very much so."
She stretches a bit, unfolding her legs and lengthening them before setting her feet on the ground with a satisfied sigh; much lighter than any of her previous exhalations had been. "So, in the interest of preparation... who is it I'm meant to go place an order with?"